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  • #61
    So it's now 2 months since buyers started reporting the issues with the Schools class. Any news on what's being done about a Back to back gauge for the valve gear joints?

    And any news on using a stronger more suitable material for the conrods, etc from now on?

    Comment


    • Andy Dapol
      Andy Dapol commented
      Editing a comment
      Nice production quality on the Video Mark.
      Regarding your request, I've commented previously that, despite only a few issues being reported to us and difficulty in reproducing the issue, we are taking notice and will make changes to eliminate the possibility of a problem in the future. Any new parts will, in due course (concurrent with the next production delivery) be made available as a spare for those who consider they need it.

      We use stainless steel for the motion and rods and there are not many other materials offering strength and the ability to etch which is required. Making the rods thicker would cause issues with clearances and aesthetics. I really do not consider a back to back gauge necessary nor of use in resolving this issue. We (and other manufacturers) do not and never have recommended tender locomotives for use on less than 2nd radius, (although driven and treated with care, they may operate acceptably) Those modeller who wish to modify the model beyond its design capability are welcome do so at their own risk.
      I realise that you may disagree with these comments (which should be read as part of other comments and postings on this subject and where we have demonstrate our commitment to our customers) I do believe that our reaction is fair and proportionate.
      As I have offered before, I'm happy to discuss this with you (or anyone else) in person at any of the exhibitions which Dapol attend.

      Regards
      Andy

  • #62
    Ye, that's not actually true about R2, Andy. Farish use the sentence This loco performs best on R2 - which is greatly different to Must not be run on R1 to prevent damage. And I can't see anything at all about radius on Dapol's sheet for the Schools

    The schools bending the valve gear and conrods when being run in on a rolling road suggests that actually you do need a back to back gauge.

    I find it had to believe that this exceptionally soft material on the valve gear and conrods is stainless steel, and if it is then the compound is wrong. Due to the over size of the valve gear to conrod joint and the thickness of the bogie wheels, clearance issues already exist. The black and white photo shows how thick (front to back not the diameter) or how slender if you like the bogie wheels were on steam locos

    Comment


    • Andy Dapol
      Andy Dapol commented
      Editing a comment
      Please re-read my posts Mark. We Recommend R2 or greater.

  • #63
    As noted in an earlier post Dapol have taken steps to correct this by printing the radius restriction on the label not a lot more they can do going forward. As someone who has come back into model railways and having had OO in the 70's and N originally from the 90's it has in my opinion been common knowledge that fine scale models should not be run on less than R2 or 'toy trainset' curves as they should be called.

    Yes there are circumstances where you might be forced to lay a curve less than R2 in that instance you HAVE to follow prototypical operation and reduce the speed of the loco to a crawl to negotiate the 'non-standard' track.

    I for one would rather see a loco with correctly scaled wheels on bogies and main drives, with flanges to match than micro wheels and pizza cutters. Movements with reasonably scaled connection rods and not heavy thick bars that would spoil the look of the model are also not wanted by myself and many others.

    Maybe there is an option to offer a 'non scale' front bogie for anyone wishing to run on trainset curves, but I want to run on sweeping curves and be able to fit steps and pipes where provided. I don't profess to be so involved to run timetables or anything like that but I certainly want the loco to look as prototypical as it can.

    Dapol seem to have taken on board the small proportion of failures of this loco design, they have it seems offered resolution and the possibility of a design tweak. I really do not see what else they can do. I would take up the offer to discuss it in person as often the written words do not convey things in the manner intended.

    Dapol created this digest to get feedback and they realised I am sure that it would not all be positive, I don't see any other manufacturers offering a similar opportunity to not only critique but actually to actively work with the manufacturer on spotting errors, making corrections and suggesting new models.

    Don't get me wrong I fully sympathise with the heartache of buying something that then fails or has a fault, but manufacturing of anything will have a percentage of failures it is annoying when it is yours that is affected.

    Comment


    • Andy Dapol
      Andy Dapol commented
      Editing a comment
      Just to add that my comments only apply to tender locos, not to small tank locos and I'd like to clarify that we have not imposed a <new> radius restriction. We "Recommend the model is run on R2 or greater", having same meaning as the phrase my colleges at Bachmann prefer (which was pointed out by Mark). In fact, all N gauge tender models have used this criteria since Dapol have produced such models. Its been poorly advertised in the past, but that's fixed now. Designing specifically for R1 would compromise the design of the model, whilst laying R2 track adds 2" 6/8ths to the overall width of the layout. I realise many people are under space restraints, and/or have already built layouts, which is why we are publicising our R2 recommendation enabling folk to make informed choices.
      I have run this and other of our products on R1, and as you state, with care they run OK, posters on this and other forums have also indicated success, but many factors can influence running, particularly over turnouts.

      We to are sympathetic when things go wrong, hence the provision of our manufactures warranty.

  • #64
    The metal used on Farish steam is stronger than Dapol and doesn't look any more bulky.

    Comment


    • #65
      I finally managed to complete the running in of my schools class with the 30 minutes in reverse at club last night. Blow me down a derailment did cause the wheels to lock in the valve gear. However thanks to the contributors on hear I knew that they needed to be loosened off and they became free. It was my fault as I had forgotten to remove the small rectangular packing piece from between the engine and tender before setting it on its way and of course it wouldn't negotiate the curve

      Silly old me!

      Comment


      • Mark Ellis
        Mark Ellis commented
        Editing a comment
        I was quite surprised at the method used by Dapol to pack the gap. The bit of black plastic is really not obvious, is it. A bit of foam is a more obvious method

      • Joel Dapol
        Joel Dapol commented
        Editing a comment
        Foam would not be that easy to fit though Mark as something rigid is required once the shaft is in place.

      • Hailstone
        Hailstone commented
        Editing a comment
        The use of a black plastic packing piece between engine and tender has been part of the packaging for several Dapol tender locos (Manor, Hall, Grange Britannia) and as far as I know has not been the cause of problems up until now

    • #66
      Any news on the next issue of Schools class locos? They seem to have sold well.

      Comment


      • Joel Dapol
        Joel Dapol commented
        Editing a comment
        Hello Bob, yes they have sold quite well and we are working on a second batch for release towards the end of the year. Do you and other members have any requests?

    • #67
      As a BR modeller I would like to see:

      30929 Malvern in BR Green early emblem - which I think it wore until scrapped in 1962 (there are much better historians on the Schools class than myself!). I have certainly seen a early crest Malvern photo alongside green 33s in 1962, and to my knowledge only this and 30908 Westminster wore BR green with early crest

      30913 Christ's Hospital in BR black or Green late emblem
      30936 Cranleigh in BR Black early emblem - which I think it wore quite late, at least to 1959
      30937 Epsom in BR Black early emblem or Green late emblem

      My choices for the last three are of course personal reasons due to living and working in the Horsham and Epsom area. I am sure everyone will have similar personal preferences and you won't make everyone happy.

      Bob

      Comment


      • #68
        Good to know they are selling well I'd like to see 928 Stowe in SR Maunsell or Malachite pre war green if possible, 900 Eaton in SR olive green, or a War time black schools or perhaps a southern schools train pack, like what you've done with flying Scotsman recent train and coach packs just a thought I found a colour art pic from OS Nocks book of pocket encyclopaedia of British Steam locomotives which has a picture of a Wartime black schools class No 930 Radley.

        Comment


        • Richard Dapol
          Richard Dapol commented
          Editing a comment
          Thank you and Bob for your suggestions, we are working on the next batch as Joel says, I notice the wartime black is of interest, this was not in our initial thoughts but we shall look at this as a possible production.
          Thanks again, Richard
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