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Maunsell Coaches - 2 new coaches

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  • Jeff Eastmond
    commented on 's reply
    Hello Richard, sorry to be revisiting this after a period, but I have just noticed an error in your proposed product list - BTK 3730 is not a BTK(6). This appears to be a victim of a mass replacement in my spreadsheet as I swear it was correct earlier... Possibly you could do BTK(6) 3733 instead and look to including its partner BCK 6674 when the BTK(4) and BCKs are produced?

    Apologies for the confusion and a corrected spreadsheet has been uploaded.

    EDIT: In answer to your question, yes, the sets did have the appropriate numbers included on the outside ends of the BTKs.
    Last edited by Jeff Eastmond; 10 July 2019, 09:36.

  • Paul South Midlands
    commented on 's reply
    A little attention with a razor saw would soon sort the double bonnet!

  • Jeff Eastmond
    commented on 's reply
    I could cope with no set numbers on the end as I have already been putting my own on in previous releases. The running numbers on the SR lined Olive Green coaches are so small and lost amongst all the lining so the couple of mis-numbered ones I am running I'm leaving be, and I have already renumbered the BR(S) Green ones using the usual method.

  • Jeff Eastmond
    commented on 's reply
    Flag down

    3775 and 3780 were D.2110 BTKs with the lavatory vent mod so run them with the corridor side showing...

    The only difference between D.2102 and D.2110 was internal (sliding door instead of hinged door between corridor and guard's compartment)...
    Last edited by Jeff Eastmond; 27 March 2019, 13:22.

  • Paul South Midlands
    replied
    This is superb news Joel. Could I suggest that you produce also a high window BCK.

    This would enable you to sell two of the 'legendary' 2 sets P (sets 25 and 27) which were formed of a high window BCK and a high window 6 compartment BCK.

    Set 25: BTK 3780, BCK 6665.
    Set 27: BTK 3775, BCK 6603.

    If there were any quirks with lavatory bonnets and the like I'm sure Jeff will jump in and flag it. :-)

    These 2 sets P, formed in 1948, were the staple branch line trains on the SR lines west of Exeter in BR years.

    (the other 2p sets used flush sided stock so would not be suitable).

    For information there were also some sets over the years that mixed up high and low window stock
    Last edited by Paul South Midlands; 25 March 2019, 22:37. Reason: BCK number on set 27 corrected

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  • Pete33
    replied
    Hopefully we can indeed prove you wrong, Joel. You can certainly put me down for five coaches of various types. Would it be worth conducting a poll here, on RMWeb, and the NGF to see what kind of uptake you could expect?

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  • Joel Dapol
    commented on 's reply
    I will look at the possibility of producing a small number on this run and see how it goes. Our experience tells us unnumbered versions do not do too well, but I am prepared to be proven wrong.

  • Pete33
    replied
    Originally posted by Mark Ellis View Post
    Having all coaches as blank and providing water transfers would be a massive step forward for model railways.
    Would love to have set 201 / 202 / 203 if there're really going to make High window coaches
    Even without the transfers it would be welcome. Fox Transfers would be able to supply the numbers.

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  • Mark Ellis
    replied
    Having all coaches as blank and providing water transfers would be a massive step forward for model railways.
    Would love to have set 201 / 202 / 203 if there're really going to make High window coaches

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  • Pete33
    replied
    Any chance of producing unnumbered versions of each of the coach types so that those of us who need different sets are saved the messy half of a tedious job?

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  • Jeff Eastmond
    replied
    Hello Richard,

    Sorry for not getting back sooner as I was on the road on Friday and at Alexandra Palace on Saturday - I did ask for you on the Dapol stand, sorry I missed you.

    That production list looks good to me, and yes the BTKs did have the set numbers painted on the end.

    The EPs I saw in the cabinet at Ally Pally looked excellent, I look forward to getting the finished product on the layout (but my CC isn't)...

    Regards Jeff

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  • Richard Dapol
    replied
    Hi Jeff,
    After reading through your extensive document for which I thank you, the first run will be in Lined Olive and we plan to produce the following models:-
    4-coach set number 193
    6-coach set number 456
    BTK(6) number 3730
    CK number 5635
    FK number 7228
    TK number 1122
    I do have a question though regarding the sets, I assume they have the set number printed on the BTK ends.
    Thank you again for your help and do you have any comments?
    Best Regards,
    Richard

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  • Richard Dapol
    replied
    Hi Jeff,
    Thank you so much for your comments and lists, really excellent and very helpful. I need to digest this information and will post suggestions soon.
    Best Regards,
    Richard

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  • Jeff Eastmond
    replied
    <deleted>...

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  • Jeff Eastmond
    replied
    Hello Richard,

    Presumably the high-window stock you are producing are the initial batches which are effectively the low window stock with high-windows in the corridor side. One has to be careful as to which ones you do produce as a small external modification to the diagrams in 1932 would cause issues.

    I have attached extracts from my spreadsheets which give the number ranges applicable to the coaches. The ones marked (DB) have a change to the ventilation bonnets over the lavatory windows - a minor, but noticeable change to your current designs, and best avoided.

    Also attached is the original formations of set produced from this stock - a large proportion of which were originally intended to be 'loose' stock, some of which were drafted into sets some time into their service life.

    Beware of the stock for 'Inter-Company' trains - the CKs for these services (both loose and in sets) had 3 first- and 4 third-class compartments (designated CK(A) on the spreadsheets), not the usual 4 first- and 3 third-; and the BTKs and BCKs were fitted with the smaller British Standard gangways for interoperability with GWR and LMS stock (at the brake end of the vehicle on BTKs and both ends on the BCKs), not the Southern-standard Pullman gangway. Unfortunately this includes Peter's set 459, which included 4-compartment BTKs not the 6-compartment ones...

    Probably the most suitable sets for your production would be 3-sets 387 and 201; and 4-sets 193, 195, 426 and 429. The 4-sets had 2x CKs in between the BTKs, one of which was removed after a few years - if you produced a 4-car version then those who wished to model the 3-car variant would then have a spare loose CK.

    Set 456 has been the subject of much additional investigation for me. King lists a 6-car formation, the one you quoted in your post. Gould, in his 'Maunsell's SR Steam Carriage Stock', lists 456 as a three set and notes it with set 387 and 'two loose FKs' [7398/99] as being on the Bognor services. I am minded to side with King, as if 456 was outshopped as a 3-set it would have been numbered either 386 or 388, not in the 'long-set' number range.

    I would suggest producing a three-set BTK(6)-CK-BTK(6) and/or set 456 and some loose stock BTK, TK, CK and FK vehicles to start with, and when the BCK and 4-compartment BTK variants are available producing a two-set BTK(6)-BCK (179 or 200) and loose BTK(4) and BCK vehicles

    I think duplicating the production sequence that you had with the low-window stock (SR Olive Green first, next BR(S) Green, then BR Crimson/Cream) will probably be the best way you can release the liveries.

    Any further questions please contact me - I can't guarantee a quick reply as I am away for a few days but I'll do my best.

    Regards

    Jeff Eastmond

    Click image for larger version

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    Last edited by Jeff Eastmond; 10 July 2019, 09:58.

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