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Black Label A4 - Opening post:

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  • #46
    Hi Joel, I had realised after my post after seeing other 'Joel Bright' topics that something was not quite right. while you are here, I posted a note 4 days ago on this section. can you have a look at it. my main concern is that the Eagle does not work at all now - as it trips the controller in an instant of pressing 'start' - and the Mallard can only just get around 3rd radius curves [i'm using sectional track, R609's] with a push, but will not move into a 2nd radius curve. it appears to be the 6 fixed wheelset which looks to create a high pressure [as the ecos shows a high millamps reading as it starts to run round a 3rd rad' curve. for the Eagle, I can pop it back for an exchange at the shop, For the Mallard - I do use 2nd radius track predominately, which I was hoping the blurb and your work on the floating Cantazzi had mean't 2nd radius was an option.


    • Joel Dapol
      Joel Dapol commented
      Editing a comment
      Hi Yes, bring it back and we can take a look and exchange it for a Mallard and give it a quick pass down our test loop here. My apologies for the inconvenience. Any day next week, except Monday would be good for me, although I will let Neil know if Monday is better for you.
      Last edited by Joel Dapol; 10th February 2017, 15:29. Reason: Additional

  • #47
    Thanks Joel. i'll bring in both the Eagle and the Mallard - Monday might be best for me, due to the weeks work commitments. i know your shop opens at 10am - can I pop along earlier eg 9:30am? it would be nice to see the 2 exchanged A4's working on your track before I leave the shop, if that's ok - so hopefully no further time off work.


    • Joel Dapol
      Joel Dapol commented
      Editing a comment
      Yes, this will be fine, just ask for Neil. Kind Regards

  • #48
    I would be interested to know if the exchanged loco's run happily on 2nd radius curves.
    Thanks, Peter


    • #49
      hi PeterG how did your exchanged loco's run on 2nd radius curves and points? Bob


      • #50
        Hi bob h I haven't exchanged any locos, in fact I don't have one yet!.
        I was hoping for a response from Munchkin56


        • Munchkin56
          Munchkin56 commented
          Editing a comment
          Hi Peter, unfortunately I have been working long hours, so have not had the time to get them on the tracks yet. will try 3rd radius for a while and then 2nd radius, once they have been run in. see my next note too!

      • #51
        I took my 2 models [Golden Eagle and Mallard] off to the Chirk shop last week and saw Neil. can I say that the experience was good, in that firstly Neil had set up the test track ready for when I popped along, so I didn't have to wait long, as I was working the rest of the day. the track was 3rd radius and Neil ran both a new Golden Eagle and a new Mallard for me to demonstrate that the to-be exchange models were working before I left the shop with them. After some discussions, it was evident that the Golden Eagle was quite tight in the middle 2 of the middle 6 wheels, so this appeared to be why they were both struggling to get round a 3rd radius curve. so there needed to be some minor play in the 6 wheelset to allow the loco to move around a curve, whether 2nd or 3rd radius. Neil suggested that it might be best to run in the model on the 3rd to allow some easing up of the mechanism, and so the loco would then be able to circumvent a 2rd radius without a hitch. so that's my plan! Can I just say, that both Neil and the other staff were courteous and accommodating on my visit. as per previous note, I am working long hours, so its only weekends that I can catch up with things, so I am hoping that the next weekend, I can give both models a good run on a 3rd and i'll report back with the findings.


        • PeterG
          PeterG commented
          Editing a comment
          Hi Munchkin56, Thanks for the feedback, good to hear that you had a courteous and very*helpful*visit to Dapol.
          The reason I'm holding back from buying one is because I have a 21" radius curve on my layout, which can't be changed.
          That's why I'm interested in the performance on 2nd and 3rd radius curves.
          Living in Australia makes it difficult to exchange a faulty loco.

      • #52
        I received my replacement Bittern this week after returning the original following an issues with running on 4th radius or tighter curves. I gave the new model a run this evening and I am pleased to report that it is perfectly happy on 4th radius. There is clearly a bit of resistance on 3rd radius but unlike my original model it does not derail. I haven't yet tried it on anything tighter than this or tried it over much point work. Will give it more of a run at the weekend but delighted that I can now make full use of this fabulous model. Thanks to the Dapol team for their swift response.


        • #53

          I'm still having a problem with my black label A4 sound and smoke turning on if I operate another loco.

          This time it's Mallard that seems to be giving me grief. Bittern does it very rarely now. If I operate another loco by a different manufacturer, regardless if the sound on this loco is on or not, Mallard starts up. Ironically even if I operate Bittern which is the same make, Mallard still switches on.

          I've set CV29 to 2 to both Loco's which has turned DC running off but it doesn't appear to have made a difference to Mallard much.

          I've amended CV1, CV3, CV4, CV29, CV161 which I think is headlight brightness, and CV220 on both loco's. I'm also using a Hornby Elite which is running software 1.41.

          Any idea's anyone as I'm left scratching my head as to what the possible problem could be?

          I'm wondering is each loco is drawing a lot of current from the track, more than which my Elite can handle which is causing the electrical gremlin within each loco?

          Kind Regards

          Last edited by creilly81; 4 weeks ago.


          • #54
            Try increasing DCC Startup Timer

            CV228 Values 0-255 Initial Value 1

            Bit 7

            Bit 0
            0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1
            On power up, the decoder will wait this much time in seconds to detect the DCC system. If this value is too low, DC mode will start the system resulting in strange behavior. The initial value is 1 second.


            • creilly81
              creilly81 commented
              Editing a comment
              Ah ha, will give that a go later, thanks for that. It could well be the issue.

              I need to try and update my elite to 1.43 also, as I'm running 1.41. Trouble is I don't have access to a laptop/computer either at home or work that will allow me to download the update. I have a work laptop which is extremely limited and another which is running Vista....Not helpful.

              I think I will try and CV228 method first and see how I go.... If all else fails I think i'll take them to the London Modelling show later this month for Dapol to test.

          • #55
            Ok - have set CV228 of both loco's to 5 initially and it's made no difference to Mallard which is the worst offender.
            I then changed the same CV to 8 and it's still the same.

            interestingly Mallard switches on automatically when I operate Bittern - and as they are both from the same manufacturer, my suspicions are now starting to point towards the Elite.
            My laptop at home is old and is running Vista and my computer at work doesn't allow me to download and install 3rd party software.....

            Can I update the Elite to 1.43 via Vista?


            • Bulver
              Bulver commented
              Editing a comment
              Apologies, I have just realised your comments were posted a week ago. However, my post of today sill offers relevant advice for all users of the Elite controller

          • #56
            You definitely need to update your Elite software, I believe the latest version is 1.43. Also, I can see no reason why your Vista laptop cannot be used to do this. I will, however check on the Hornby forums, where there is a fantastic amount of help and advice on this subject, and will report back. I am not suggesting that this will resolve the particular Black Label problem, but it is worth a try........I'll be back!
            Last edited by Bulver; 1 week ago. Reason: I am back! As I stated the latest software is 1.43, and there is useful advice on updating on the 'dcc' section of the Hornby forum. Some really knowledgeable chaps on there, I can't help as I use R


            • #57
              Originally posted by Bulver View Post
              You definitely need to update your Elite software, I believe the latest version is 1.43. Also, I can see no reason why your Vista laptop cannot be used to do this. I will, however check on the Hornby forums, where there is a fantastic amount of help and advice on this subject, and will report back. I am not suggesting that this will resolve the particular Black Label problem, but it is worth a try........I'll be back!

              I've since updated my Elite to version 1.43 and I'm still getting the same problem.
              Other forums have asked to try an alternative controller and/or layout as it is possible that my set-up could be causing an interference with the decoder within the loco.
              However about 6 weeks ago I had Bittern running round a new layout which was a big basic loop around my kitchen and dining room and the loco still did the same and switched on when I operated another loco.

              Am now guessing I've ruled the issue with my layout being the problem, that the only conceivable solution is a compatibility issue with the Elite?
              i honestly don't see how though because the Hornby system is extremely robust and NRMA compliant.

              Am literally stumped!


              • Joel Dapol
                Joel Dapol commented
                Editing a comment
                Is there any chance you could try the loco on another layout? if not, I can make arrangements t get it sent back and we can check it out on the controller hand sets we have here. At the end of the day, it might be a loco problem and I guess it would best to eliminate that possibility first of all. email me on and I can make arrangements to suit you.